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Post by dizzum_D on Mar 12, 2007 18:06:30 GMT -5
Oh and damn man I just sold my 3561sp.
Did you get it from Dejon? I did and he sent me mine with the 4 bolt outlet.
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Post by wishihadatalon on Mar 13, 2007 0:02:51 GMT -5
Man that turbo looks familiar Everything looks really good man. Let me know when you get your turbo in, and I will come down and check it out.
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Post by Green92gsx on Mar 14, 2007 15:40:10 GMT -5
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Post by dizzum_D on Mar 14, 2007 15:53:36 GMT -5
I'd rather have the 4 bolt outlet. A bit more of a PITA to work with and clearance etc, but they do produce more power. I've seen some dyno's where all they did was change the turbine housing and it produced an extra 7whp and 50 rpms quicker spool.
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Post by autox4fun on Mar 14, 2007 16:22:35 GMT -5
Yes, your gonna be good with the DIS-2. Something about most the cop coils like the 300m coils have a dwell problem. They weren't designed to be fired on the waste spark system like the stock coils and without the help of a dis-2 or so, they fail prematurely. the current waste spark coils fire every 360 degrees of rotation. COP is only going to require every 720 degrees of rotation. COP is going to allow for more dwell time, cooler running coils, better control of spark, more completed combustion = more power.... but I worry about "just hooking up the wires" as it's still going to fire every 360... not 720 which you'll need for true control.. when talking with tym at one of the shootouts he made mention of the aem controller being able to do a switched output... like it was able to switch between fire cycles. like every other "trigger" was flipped between each cylinder. fire 1 then switch to fire 4 the next time and back.... the MSD may have more power but I'd be worried about cooking the final stage. in series may have it's problems also being that most coils secondary circuit is tied back into the trigger side to start the dwell mode again..... coils are design to fire in one direction only..(unless your ford and you like to design your own nightmare) nino give some more thought to this... you may need a controller for this setup... and I don't believe the Msd is able to in the long run... Randy
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Post by 99gst_racer on Mar 14, 2007 16:50:07 GMT -5
I'd rather have the 4 bolt outlet. A bit more of a PITA to work with and clearance etc, but they do produce more power. I've seen some dyno's where all they did was change the turbine housing and it produced an extra 7whp and 50 rpms quicker spool. Please link me to where you read/saw this. I really find that extremely difficult to believe. If both housings are and the same inlet flange and the same A/R, I don't see an outlet flange making any kind of flow/power difference. Afterall, they are the same inlet area and outlet area..... You can gain 7 WHP from a cool down period between pulls. Also, 50 rpm's is obvious a difference of a fraction of a second - how did they accurately measure this?
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Post by dizzum_D on Mar 14, 2007 16:58:54 GMT -5
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Post by 99gst_racer on Mar 14, 2007 17:03:04 GMT -5
They are talking about 2.5" and 3" hosuings in that thread. The member that made the claim of gains has offered nothing to support his claim, nor has he mentioned that they were the same size hosuings tested. Even though the gain was only a claimed 1%, I'm still not yet convinced.....
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Post by dizzum_D on Mar 14, 2007 17:11:04 GMT -5
Alright thats why both Garrett and Turbonetics use either v band or 4 bolt housings on there new turbo's. Sure t-netics offers 5 bolt housings but only to suit those already with a ford style exhaust.
If the 5 bolt style made more power, you'd see garrett and t-netics using them, but wait, no, they all use 4 bolt housings and v band's now.
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Post by 99gst_racer on Mar 14, 2007 17:39:43 GMT -5
Alright thats why both Garrett and Turbonetics use either v band or 4 bolt housings on there new turbo's. Sure t-netics offers 5 bolt housings but only to suit those already with a ford style exhaust. If the 5 bolt style made more power, you'd see garrett and t-netics using them, but wait, no, they all use 4 bolt housings and v band's now. I never said the 5-bolt flows more. They are the same internal size - they perform the same. The only difference is that the 5-bolt housing has more "meat" in the casting for internal gate provisions. The new turbo's don't use the 5-bolt housing, because they are all intended to be used with pre-turbo mounted, external wastegates. On the offensive side of the debate; name one attribute that leads to a performance gain of a 4-bolt housing over a 5-bolt housing. Sorry for the technical hijacking, Angelo.
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Post by Green92gsx on Mar 14, 2007 17:43:01 GMT -5
Are you sure they didn't switch from say from a Garrett 4 bolt .63 to a pte 4bolt .63? All pte turbine housings were re-casted to flow better and fit larger turbine wheels. In testing it's been said that the 5 bolt pte .63 will flow as much as a Garrett 4 bolt .82 with better fitment. This is both back pressure and performance. Why do you think AMS only uses the .63 5 bolt Pte in there kits ?
Randy, I've been back in forth about the c.o.p with Luke and he reassured me wired in series with the msd would be fine without meltdown. I know alot of people running the exact setup with no problem without a controller. I do plan on keeping my coil and wires in the back of the truck for just in case. Along with everything else that could break. ;D How's your car running Randy?
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Post by wishihadatalon on Mar 14, 2007 18:04:13 GMT -5
Haha you don't owe me anything. I would however love the ride ;D Any word on your turbo?
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Post by Green92gsx on Mar 14, 2007 18:21:16 GMT -5
End of the month. Dejon wouldn't give me a good break if I bought it without a cover. Forced Performance has the sweet Garrett stye S anti-surge cover for me but it wasn't worth it with Dave only giving me a $80 off. It kinda pissed me off, he could have at least met me half way.
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Post by autox4fun on Mar 14, 2007 18:26:30 GMT -5
She's sleepy still.... haha I haven't touch a thing this winter.. between work and school I've been a very busy beaver... school ends at the end of april and I'll start to play a little here and there.. tuning is the main goal this year... I've been in class for advance fuels this time around and I'm trying to get as much info in my head as possible.. in fact I'm in chicago this week doing training with bmw for the body electronics. In class at valley I've tried to pay close attention to ignition system... that the only reason I bring that up... the "ford coils" I have for my car are wired internally such. on a bmw coil it's set up better wiring pins 1- main 12v supply 2- ground for secondary coil 3- trigger from pcm/ignition module
but on the ford setup 1- main 12v supply 2- trigger from pcm and internally the secondary circuit is tied into pin 2 to back feed to start charging the coil again... I tried using the ford coils last year and the car would not fired up. this was after running in series, diode isolating circuit, running in parallel... still nothing... put the stock set up back on and fired right up... our stock coil primary resistance is around 1.3 ohms... secondary is around 13k ohms... this runs about 10 amps and full song... series would lessen this around 6 amps parallel would double this around 20 amps volts/ohms=amps series will be easier to handle via the module... but if the coils back feed this could stop you dead in the tracks... in theory... or in my head... long day of training... I'm going to have a beer...
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Post by SPOOLD on Mar 14, 2007 22:04:13 GMT -5
randy you're kinda above my head on the wiring aspect of this but fyi, ford coils suck. we replace em all the time at work. most commonly on all the mod motors (4.6 & 5.4) i'd suggest the typical chrysler ones or better yet, rig up some bimmer ones ::cough -warranty- cough::
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